About Auctions

[Kaptin]

Hello all,

I'm adding these comments to this board so that hopefully certain things can be avoided in future Av auctions. These comments or observations come from being involved in av auctions for nearly 7 years and over 5 years in my own site here.

I have seen well organized auctions and some fall flat on their faces.  Some people are very well adept at hosting, posting and info taking while others need help.  Here is where a problem lies in that one who is hosting an auction rely's heavily on the help others offer especially in info taking. Unfortunatley the failure or success of an auction rests solely on the shoulders of the host.

If the host(s) is posting all av's and is having them given to him, then they should download the actual av to their hard drive to a folder marked with the designers name.  The designers, name e-mail addy etc etc can be put into a notepad file and thus saved in that folder as well.

Info takers need to know who has donated what av's to the auction...namely designers name, e-mail address av number or whatever other identifier they want to use because if you do not know who the designer was for Av # 65 than what good does that do you as you won't know how to contact them.

There are many different ways in organizing the av's, their number or identifier, who won the av and who donated it.  This is where info taker(s) and host(s) need to work together.  If an Av gets lost the more info I have on that Av I can retrieve it from the logs and perhaps recover the av but I will not spend 9 days going through logs because someone fucked up.

How many Av's can an individual win?  Well, this has always been an area of concern because sometimes it seems that an auction is fixed if the same person wins one av after another.  The mathematical odds are against it. If you are suspected of fixing an auction, well, news travels fast and you may be disappointed as far as attendance is concerned at your next auction. This is something the host must decide if they want to limit av wins.

Av gifting. This is kind of a personal issue with me and with others I know as well, but if you do not intend to use an av don't bid on it and then give it away.  Auction hosts, this is your call if you want to allow this or not but I know that if it was me and someone gifted one of my avs which I spent time working on it I'd post you in PM to pull all my av's and I'd leave. I feel that gifting an av is a personal insult to the designer.

If a thread is set up on CE's board for an av auction for av pickups etc. etc. then it would be appreciated that ALL av's remain there until either claimed or unclaimed. Please DO NOT move your av's off to another board and then expect people to pick up their av wins on this other board. Your link will be removed. The av's as donated to an auuction that's hosted on CE's board become the property of CE in that respect and any unclaimed Av's will be returned to the designer once all is said and done so they could be used again.  We won't steal them but we don't want people searching through god knows how many web sites to find one av.  CE Auction threads are set so you do not have to register to pick up and leave a post.

I don't claim to be an expert in Av auctions but I do know what can make one or break one and I also know there are many who will try to undermine an av auction to try to make yours look bad.

We will help anyone who wants help, but if you think you know it all and know better, go for it and have fun. *S*

That's my 3 1/2¢ worth on Av auctions.

[craZgirl]

Well said Kaptin.

All auction hosts should be using a "random number generator" to come up with their numbers.  You can google them and find tons of them for free.  Here's one I use: http://www.mathgoodies.com/calculators/random_no_custom.html

Nothing is more boring or insulting to an auction than for one or two people to sit there and bid on and win 90% of the avs.  It's rude, it makes people look selfish and greedy, and it's bad for business.  And the reality is that the auction IS business in the sense that it's meant to draw folks to your room.  Is that really the kind of impression you want to make on them?

To keep things fair, and to allow opportunity for everyone to "share the wealth" so to speak...then as Kaptin suggested, those hosting auctions should strongly consider including a "3 win limit" in their auction rules

And like Kaptin I favor the "no gifting" rule.  Nothing is more insulting and hurtful than for a designer to sit there and be subjected to watching their av passed around from person to person.  That designer has spent their time and energy creating a piece of art. 

If you're not interested in wearing the AV for yourself then don't bid on it.  It's that simple. 

Allow the person who truly wants to wear it a better opportunity at winning it. 

If gifting is allowed, then that gift should count as a win for both the person gifting and the recipient.  Don't gift to a person unless you know for sure that they want it in advance.

If you're a designer...please remember that not everyone has your talent and the programs to make the kinds of works that you're able to make.  Auctions are a means of sharing those gifts. 

Many folks who attend auctions have no other means for acquiring avs than through the generosity and luck of winning them in auctions.  Please keep that in mind when bidding on AVs that you won't ever wear. 

You're taking that AV from someone who would gladly wear it AND you're insulting your peers in the design community if you have no intention of wearing the AV.

And finally...identify the designer and number on the av when showing at an auction.  Give the designer credit AND assist your info taker who can then record "John Doe1 av won by ~Jane Smith~".  Keep a list of the names and order or the avs shown for later reference if needed. 

[Kaptin]

One additional thing I'd like to mention is that at times more av's are donated that time permits to be shown. Feel free to announce that you want to continue the auction the next day or a few days later so you can finsih off.

[Dark Star]

On the gifting thing, some times I bid on things that I see because others are not there or I want to give something special to a person and have not found it til I see it, though when I do give it to the person I always say that I won it and who did the work!


My two cents worth!

and since making a great discovery by chance while saving a special evening I now can copy the whole room, site it if the holding site you use allows html hosting and this way there is no doubt who won what! only thing I can not do is post whispers between those whispering to others unless it is to me, and I have the option of deleting those if I feel they have no place or reason for being there!

[craZgirl]

Dark Star..I agree with you about gifting to someone you know an av would really fit or they would really enjoy, or because you see it and it reminds you of someone you want to gift it to etc.  Personally I see no issue in that at all. 

I think when it's someone you know..you know their personality..their likes..their chat style..the type of room they chat in...etc...then you're a much better judge of the type of AV they like.  I myself have bid on avs for others when they weren't there but I knew they'd like it.

What we are referring to is that person that sits there and just bids and bids and has the luck (at least we want to believe it's just luck) to keep winning and just passes the avs around (often to folks they don't know or barely know and who might not find the av appropriate to their personality).   Those types of folks can ruin an auction and sadly prevent someone who would really like the av from having it. 

Also, we've all probably been to an auction in our time where an av was passed around as a joke..that can be extremely hurtful to a designer.  I don't think folks intend to hurt like that..but they forget that a real person is probably sitting there at the time that took the time and energy to make that av.

We do encourage a win limit for a couple of reasons...one to make certain that the auction appears fair and above the board to all participating, and second so that everyone has a fair chance to participate and hopefully win something.

Thanks for your input.  You made great points. 

[Dark Star]

Oh yeah, You all are right, I was at one tonight that was a good one, I seemed to have had a run of good luck an I happen to know it was run using the generator..though one left in a huff saying they would be back when someone else was giving out the winning #, which was down right rude at least to some of us..but then again there might have been a history there


Yes passing one around is not a good thing..it will hurt a persons feelings as I have been on that end a time or two.,so much so I stopped doing them so now I just help out by taking info or as I posted in my last post know doing the room capture...

Thanks for letting Me say My two cents! I looking forward to the next one CE has!

[SnOwLaDy]

i know not EVERYONE does it but i do know a handful that DO..and its annoying lol
some will bid on every single thing they see...even if they dont have any clue who it would be for if they should happen to win it
then when they do they are stuck with *umm ok now what do i do with it*
i go to various designer boards and own one myself
i will bid in an auction or participate in a countdown only if the creation inspires me as to whom i think would wear it not just bid simply to bid to win

running a room auction takes alot of work
those who can pull it off successfully i say thumbs up to ya
and Kaptin makes alot of good points

(and waves to Dark Star while im at it)

[Darius]

Biding and gifting, I don't know and there is probably a fine line. It is pretty easy to tell sometimes when a certain person really wants a certain thing and if its obvious I don't see the harm. I do know this and bidding on someones work can indicate a appreciation for their hard work.

I have been directly involved with several auctions but never hosted one and this will be my first one coming up in June. I have always called numbers and taken info. There is some details that I believe are critical. One is to show proper respect for the people who donated designs. The major complaint I find is they are going to slow and that kind of thing. So to eliminate that I am preparing a pre coded list so all I have to do is copy and paste and ditto for the info taker. Even practice a little.

Well those are my 2 cents worth. D     

[Kaptin]

your 2¢ worth is worth more than that. shanna has done a few auctions here already and I take my hat off to her as she seems to know how to organize them well and I think she also sets a bidding time limit.

Darius, perhaps you could talk to shanna and get some ideas.

[Dark Star]

about shanna's auctions, the last one was run by only three of us.and for now it looks like the next one will be only her and I unless I am back in the hospital and for those that do not know that is where I have been  for the last few days and will not know much more til I see the cradio guy on Monday. Thanks for bearing with us! and feel free to ask any thing

[craZgirl]

Dark Star I hope you feel better very soon.  Please take care of yourself and just focus on getting well.  If shanna needs help i'm sure that there are several staff members who can pitch in.  Ya'll just give us a yell.  I second what Kap said.  I think ya'll run your auctions very well. 

The time limit for each av that has been put into place, as well as the fact that those working the auction or donating to the auction as designers cannot bid has helped them run very smoothly. 

It keeps everything moving along and removes all questions of "favoritism" to designers or auction workers.  The auctions really should be targeted to the "guests" that you are trying to draw to your room, rather than those who dontated to or those working the auction.  I think shanna was very smart to put those rules into place in her auctions.

[Dark Star]

At first I was a bit leary but after going to so many other ones where it seems only those that design are winning or being gifted them I like the way we do it..makes for more to get work they would not..If we want something both of us have mouths.-laughs cause I said it- I look forward to see how others run it..and hey ours have clitches too, but we do try to prepare for them..Good luck to everyone out there..Oh yeah the Den may do some too when I get to feeling better but those will be more geared toward BDSM!

-waves back to SL-

[shanna]

Hey kap craZ Darius and DS.

 *S* Thanks you for you thoughts and opinions. I would just like to say firstly that the Auctions we have had so far , while its only been the two , both BE and I along with DS & Wandee  have been really happy with the results, and we have the third one coming up on the 19th June . Daruis perhaps you will come in and see how we do it. Like i said i havent helped to host an awful lot yet but I love auctions and before BE and I decided to do this we spent 4 and 5 hours at many and thought of ways to make them run faster smoother and fairer...Auctions to us should be for those that have no idea how to make an av...Not to say that designers shouldnt be allowed to bid. But the ones hosting it shoudlnt be involved and the designers maybe its a chance for them to sit back and see what people do and dont like about their work. We code all our avs it didnt take long for the bidders to pick up to copy and paste and post it to the info taker. We have a lot of little things that at first seem to tedious and picky things..There are reasons..for example you do not PM the info this way if there is two or three people taking it they dont have to chase each other up . And everyone can pick up on things. Open chat as far as bids and info go keeps it all for everyone to see. And this time we wont be having the no gifting rule , it didnt work all that happened was the same two people bid on all the avs it turned out . As for gifitng im guilty as the next person if you allow gifting at your auctions i will bid and give them away, Darius i wont give details but i was at auction at another site a few months back. There was one bidder who sat and yelled i love it i love it i dont even own one. Then staff and other bidders bidding on her behalf.. Those that wanted it had almost no chance, we all pick avs to suit our personalities and moods , this lady ended up with blondes redheads brunettes it felt like she was the only one winning. A 3 win limit kills an auction it stops bidding especially if there are a few you really want. This is expereince not a guess .A quick note No matter how well you think you know a person maybe you dont....i have many avs i dont wear, simply becasue they are blonde doesnt mean i will wear them...I could go on and on explaining as we all could but this is enough for now  ...we have tried a few things and they havent worked but it seemed thats what people wanted im fairly confident our next one will be will successfull.. I will be posting details later.
Based on numbers and av wins on our last one we will have an 8 win limit i know sounds odd but with 30 people attending our last one 4 averaged 8 wins ..if we can get 60 bidders their wins wont be as high especially with the no gifting rule no longer in place...
Just to finish All staff DD room members and regulars have offered or contributed in some way to our Auctions ..it could have been something like coding for us. Or making avs etc. But one important thing is BE has spent many hours with me discussing what will and wont work , in all honesty these Auctions work because of how we do it together...Well thats the case so far..DS I think we need three or 4  Auction staff regardless so a second info taker will be welcome also thanks *S*

[BodiesEntwined(M)]

My viewpoint on auctions and how shanna and I run it...  I am a stickler for details on events or most any project I do or have my name attached.  Yes, it  is amazing that shanna has managed to put up me and not get any more insane than she is....  lol    Oopps, did I say that?

When shanna and I started auctions we made notes of what we liked and how we could improve them if we decided to do one.  We did spend countless hours trying to make what we thought was a smooth auction and have come up to where we are now.   Most might think we were/are crazy for spending so much time brain storming.

I believe in marketing as we all do it every day.  It doesn't matter if you're marketing your auction, coming into a room for the first time or 100th time, going for a job interview, or meeting people r/t, it all has to do with marketing or presentation.  For some does that statement seem over the top or excessive?  I'm sure it does.  Before shanna and I did our first auction and still to this day, we asked questions, did polls in the room to find out what people really thought and wanted, and tried to figure out how to fix things better by observations of what we saw going on in the room. 

We focused on 4 main areas that, in our opinion, make an auction successful.  First, they should flow and keep the pace going and not drag out.  Second, auction staff should communicate how it is being run to people not only in the room at the start but others that come in later.  That is why we have abbreviated rules under shanna's name and where to view the avs and where to pick them up under mine.  Thirdly, everything is out in the open so everyone can see what is going on throughout.  If there is anyone with any questions, we encourage them to ask right then.  It could be something we missed or didn't clarify and we can tweak that for the next auction if need be.  The last part and most important is the bidders having fun!  That's what an auction is all about!  We are always asking for opinions and want to hear from people, so give a shout.

shanna and I had done lots of prep work behind the scenes before our first one; did the what if's, tried to think of the little things that are really no big deal overall.  I can't say for anyone else but for me it's those little things that crop up that start to bug me.  Again, they're no big deal but it's no big deal on what is needed to just fix it either.. so why not just fix it.  What makes them a big deal is when those little things start to happen more and more and they all add up.

As an example, most times rules are posted at the beginning of auctions.  The problem is people pop in and out during the showing of the avs.  Some late comers may ask about certain rules during the auction like what are the numbers to bid, is gifting allowed, etc., and this may happen a few times that causes minor interruptions.  Then there are some that don't ask, they just apply what they think are standard rules or rules they've have seen at other auctions and have to be corrected.  Is it a big deal?  Not really unless you're having some malfunctions behind the scenes and working feverishly to fix it and keep the pace of the auction going smoothly so nobody really notices.. and that's about the time that people start having all those questions about rules or where do I look at avs, etc.. 

That's my two cents worth.. wait.. what's that shanna?  Oh.. shanna said that was my $5.00 worth.. yeah, yeah.. dang kids.  lol

[shanna]

Gifting was a problem at our last auction. Ok you gift to someone in the room, thinking you are being nice and doing something for a friend or stranger, what about the designer, to see their work passed around like that, they put time into and effort into this.

If you're in the room with the person you are wanting to gift to, after you bid, PM them and ask do they actually want it . Its better to withdraw your bid than insult the designer. Three separate ocassions on Friday night this happened. One was passed onto 4 different people before it had to be awarded to the next closest winner...Someone who actually really wanted it. Then twice more it didnt go to the first giftee it went to the second. These were perfect avs they werent poor quality they werent out of holiday season or anything they were mostly just not wanted due to hair colour or style etc... If  you dont want it and dont know who does dont bid on them, or at least withdraw your bid when you realise noone wants it. And once again you dont know a  persons taste just because you know they like blondes etc.....Theres many factors in an av that attract me to it, many that turn me off..as im sure it does for us all...try and think about this when you think youre being nice...In future auctions at DD you get to gift as always but if the intial  giftee doesnt want it , it wont be passed around, you wont insult designers at our auctions ,  it will be rebid and only bidders who want their name on it will be able to rebid.

[Dark Star]

Claps!

[Escape]

You wont find me at auctions.........after 15 years of av making and suppling avs for auctions....I gave up 5 years ago........I figured I made over a thousand avs.and only ever saw 2 being worn..

I've been to auctions in the past that went over 60 hours.........thats too long for those organising them..

I've also been to some shonky ones at another site.......where the same 5 won every av.....in room of over 40 ppl in it

Auctions do have there place....and I think its great that CE has some........but I do recall CraZgirl say'n...if you need an av or have need for resizing see her.

just my 3cents worth

Escape